Unabomber Property Up For Creepy Online Auction

coondoggie writes "Ok this is kind of creepy. The US Marshalls Office today said it will hold an online auction of the personal effects of the Unabomber, Ted Kaczynski. The auction will run until June 2 and will include personal documents, such as driver's licenses, birth certificates, deeds, checks, academic transcripts, photos, and his handwritten codes; typewriters; tools; clothing; watches; several hundred books; and more than 20,000 pages of written documents, including the original handwritten and typewritten versions of the 'Unabom Manifesto.'"

Not creepy but smart,

[Anonymous Coward]

Identifying people who are interested in this stuff is good, getting them to pay money to identify themselves is genius.

Re:

[Anonymous Coward]

Stupid question, but... will Unabomber fans be sending their payment in by mail?

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[repka]

Free registration in nationwide creeps database included!

Re:

[Anonymous Coward]

What do you expect from a government that doesn't care about you, your rights, or the constitution?

Re:Fruad (aka fraud)

[fredrated]

Telll me something, exactly how does a government care or not care?

Re:

[UnknowingFool]

I am disturbed by this as well. Unless Ted Kacynkski signed a waiver to allow the government to auction off what can be considered private records, I don't see how the government should be allowed to do this. Selling off other property to pay restitution to his victims, I don't have a problem with.

Re:Fraud

[Anonymous Coward]

Selling off other property to pay restitution to his victims, I don't have a problem with.

None of those things are private

[name_already_taken]

I am disturbed by this as well. Unless Ted Kacynkski signed a waiver to allow the government to auction off what can be considered private records, I don't see how the government should be allowed to do this. Selling off other property to pay restitution to his victims, I don't have a problem with.

As long as you're not a criminal, you don't have to worry about it too much. The government can't take your stuff away and sell it unless you cause them to by, for example, mailing bombs to innocent victims.

None of the items mentioned can be considered private records. Driver's licenses, birth certificates, deeds, and academic transcripts are publicly accessible anyway, even before they become evidence in a criminal trial.

The other items became public information or government property once they were ente

Re:None of those things are private

[UnknowingFool]

None of the items mentioned can be considered private records. Driver's licenses, birth certificates, deeds, and academic transcripts are publicly accessible anyway, even before they become evidence in a criminal trial.

Birth certificates and academic transcripts are considered private. Except for immediate families of the person but I can assure you that you cannot get these records of individuals from the state. That was part of the BS of the whole Birther controversy with Birthers complaining that somehow Hawaii was making an exception for Obama when it is clear in all states that birth certificates are not public records.

The other items became public information or government property once they were entered into evidence in the court proceedings against him, unless Kaczynski's attorney won a court order to have the evidence sealed or to have the items returned to him - which he didn't.

The existence of property held by the state does not automatically make a piece of property eligible for public viewing. In the many cases, all the state did was to list the property as in their possession as required by law; the state did not list the contents (or make it available to the public) especially if the piece of evidence was not used at trial.

Re:

[nbauman]

Yes, it doesn't seem as if there's any legal basis to auctioning off a lot of these items.

I assume the theory is that he damaged his victims, and they have a right to sue him, get a judgment, and sell his possessions.

Where does the marshall's office get the right to take property seized for one purpose (evidence in a criminal case), and sell it for another purpose (compensation for victims)? If they wanted to proceed in a legal way, shouldn't someone have brought a civil suit against Kaczynski? Did that hap

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[UnknowingFool]

The only thing that would seem to make sense is that after the trial, the government contacted Kaczynski about returning his property and he never responded back. Thus it is considered abandoned property which the government can sell. Given Kaczynski's viewpoints on the government and his lack of concern of worldly goods, it wouldn't be out of his character to ignore the government or not care what happened to his things. I would hope that private records need explicit permission and not implicit permiss

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[SnarfQuest]

As long as you're not a criminal, you don't have to worry about it too much. The government can't take your stuff away and sell it unless you cause them to by, for example, mailing bombs to innocent victims.

Its already been decided by the courts, that if a state wants to sell your property to a mall developer, they can seize it from you and you can do nothing about it. So why would you think that the federal government would grant themselves less power?

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[SockPuppetOfTheWeek]

Handy rule-of-thumb for would-be fraudsters: avoid using names of famous, infamous, or fictitious people. It makes you rather conspicuous.

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[secretcurse]

I think it would be awesome to use his driver's license at the liquor store...

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[billcopc]

You've clearly never signed up for something with a fake name. Today's CS reps, even government staff, are so freakin' ignorant, they actually believe any name you give them.

I've a few friends who get a kick out of doing just that, registering phones, government services, and in one epic stunt a complete set of ID using celebrity or made-up names including:

- Pablo Escobar
- Cosmo Kramer
- LaToya Jackson
- William Shatner
- Tony Montana
- Travis Bickle
- Buck Futter
- Ron Jeremy
- Charles Manson

Whether you attribut

In your face

[creat3d]

"We will use the technology that Kaczynski railed against in his various manifestos to sell artifacts of his life. [...]" said U.S. Marshal Albert Nájera of the Eastern District of California in a statement.

Re:In your face

[fuzzyfuzzyfungus]

I'm certain that watching the state sneeringly auction off his personal effects on the internet from his cage for the amusement of the crowd will serve as a devastating rebuke to his thesis that technology inevitably tightens its grip on the individual and drives them to ever shallower and more inauthentic attempts at activity.

I find the guy's terrorist activities deeply distasteful, and he certainly deserves to rot in jail for them; but as a theorist of the sociology of technological advance, he is actually pretty underrated...

Re:

[MightyMartian]

As they say, the gap between genius is madness is a very short one. I think Kaczynski is as good an example of that as I've ever seen. Brilliant guy who, unfortunately, didn't have the mental balance or the inner voice to tell him that you have to remain at least somewhat pragmatic and should never take an ideology too far. The only difference between him and, say Lenin or Mao, is that he was a lone nut job in a cabin and not the leader of a mass revolution, and thus was only able to cause a small amount

Re:

[MightyMartian]

Pragmatism means never assuming your ideological assumptions are absolutely right, and allowing yourself to compromise. You call it a cop-out, I call out a corollary to Asimov's famous axiom "Never let your sense of morality prevent you from doing what's right."

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[Mindcontrolled]

I'd still like to have his typewriter. I got some, erm, ideas, to type up....

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[Anonymous Coward]

I'm not sure I agree with this. You have to look at the greater picture. I don't think the state should harm people. At the same time I would agree with someone who says it is a necessity at times. The problem is it is almost never today a necessity. It is thus an abuse of the privilege. For instance we need not murder people who have committed acts which we consider to be atrocities. I'm talking about people like Saddam, Bin Laden, and other revolutionaries. This includes mass murders, kiddie murders, and

Re:

[MightyMartian]

He failed in part because he was a loner and in part because no one wants a revolution. No matter what anybody says, one man cannot create a revolution. The conditions have to be there. A single man can be the spark, but someone else has to have to spilled the gasoline.

Re:

[MightyMartian]

Well, thanks for that incredibly critique. The only thing missing is you flinging shit around. Well, maybe you are. You sound like the type.

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[uninformedLuddite]

You added the caveat at the end. It aint going to save you from the government now.

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[luis_a_espinal]

I have to agree. This one is going to blow up in the US Marshal's office face, figuratively speaking. It comes off as petty.

They are going to use the proceedings to compensate the victims. How's that petty?

Re:

[Kamiza Ikioi]

I like your irony there. However, it's ok to laugh at some people in cages. ;)

In your face?

[scrccrcr]

Your words make sense, but when you criticise His actions you indeed support the system (which is bad) by not committing yourself to a serious position against the bad,horrible system (because you can just brush that aside for the sake of some leftist ideal like how everyone deserves to live (like glen beck)). You can't separate the good from the bad -- unless, of course, you want to get laid and get paid. The system will appreciate such weakness. The system appreciates the same weakness in the women,child

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[blair1q]

Dude didn't think that throwing bombs was an inauthentic attempt at political speech enabled by technology?

Or was his point that we should regress even beyond the invention of explosives, or maybe fire?

Dude was a nutter. Nothing he said is credible, no matter how closely it might randomly match sapient expression.

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[Hazel Bergeron]

"If we urinate on the Koran, it makes us more right," said US Marshal Albert Nájera of the Eastern District of California in a statement.

Creepy

[Dan East]

So what's the deal? He was hoarding Halloween decorations and stuff too?

Re:

[guybrush3pwood]

Why? Please elaborate.

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[luis_a_espinal]

Why? Please elaborate.

AC seems to be entangled with the is/ought problem [wikipedia.org] while riding a high horse ;)

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[MDillenbeck]

I agree with the poster that scored low. I think the Unabomber is of historical and academic interest, and that his resources should be put into a format to be used by academics who wish to do further research on this historically significant figure. By auctioning off the items to a private party who will gain exclusive ownership rights, we are commercializing the relevant historical documents and restricting who can have access to them. I guess the question is this: do you feel ownership of information

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[guybrush3pwood]

What I think is that this douche is not an historical figure. He's a plain-old contemporary criminal, though famous. Nothing more, nothing else. His shit is of no value outside criminal records and the sensationalist press. The content of his papers can be digitalized and the actual papers burned. Nothing of value is lost. If someone wants to make a buck out of that crap, and someone is crazy enough to pay for it... they're all welcome to it.

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[Lunix Nutcase]

Making money off a madman/criminal seems wrong.

And by "making money off of a madman/criminal" you mean selling his stuff to pay restitution to his victims, right? I see nothing wrong with that.

Re:

[obarthelemy]

as opposed to spending money preserving the memory and legacy of a madman, which is SO right.

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[lexsird]

Where its seriously wrong is its a reinforcement of the personification of a villain who has creepy people who idolize this sort of behavior. This shit should have all ended up in a dumpster some place instead of glorified like this. I would think the victims would recoil in horror at being giving money from creeps who idolize this guy and his stuff. It seems like a slap in the face, if the victims need money, shouldn't someone have helped them by now instead of waiting for this creepy auction to bear fruit

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[uncqual]

And would this also apply to Bernie Madoff's possessions?

I don't see a difference. Both should be sold with the proceeds going to the victims or to the government to help defray the cost of keeping them in prison for the rest of their lives.

Obviously if a museum wanted them, they could bid on them.

What?

[CheerfulMacFanboy]

No bombs? At least plans?

Killer Paraphernalia

[retroworks]

History Channel should start running "American Pickers" and "Pawn Stars" episodes on murderer paraphernalia. Maybe do an episode on the auction from Bin Laden's TV, shawl and porn stash. Lee Harvey O's toybox. Eventually, America's supply side could glut the market.

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[CosaNostra Pizza Inc]

I think the History Channel should do away with "American Pickers"...and "Pawn Stars" and all the other pawn shows as well as "ice Road Truckers", "Axe Men" and "Swamp People". The later three have absolutely nothing to do with History anyway.

Montana Property

[ISoldat53]

Too bad the Montana property isn't included. It's in a pretty part of the state.

Re:Montana Property

[DerekLyons]

Kaczynski's Montana property was sold last year. This is an auction of personal property, probably the items that were seized from the cabin as evidence.

Slashdot: nerd news up to the minute...

[MickyTheIdiot]

...too bad CNN has been crying about the Kacynkski auction for 2 WEEKS now.

Not only behind... 2 weeks behind.

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[Lunix Nutcase]

Only two weeks behind? That's not bad for Slashdot. We've had stories posted based off blog postings that have been anywhere from 6 months to more than a year old by the time it hit Slashdot.

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[ari_j]

...too bad CNN has been crying about the Kacynkski auction for 2 WEEKS now.

Not only behind... 2 weeks behind.

The editors had to wait until someone blogged about it and then submitted his own blog article to the site.

Re:

[blair1q]

all it takes is for enough ignorami to click the + button in the firehose. and there are a LOT of ignorami on /.

Psychological Experiments

[waterford0069]

What's sad about this is that Kaczynski was the subject of what I'll argue were some pretty wicked and unethical psychological experiments when he was in school - long before he ever became a danger to the world. Some have suggested that these experiments pushed him over the edge.

Re:Psychological Experiments

[rtb61]

Actually the whole idea of this auction comes off a pretty crass and pathetic. The auctioning off of the personal affects of what was clearly a mentally disturbed individual, only claimed as sane by a very distorted US legal system (clearly his actions speak volumes about his lack of mental stability). It's looks like the US marshals office in all of it's jock strap douchiness is celebrating the failure of an ohh evil intellectual, "We will use the technology that Kaczynski railed against" speaks very much of petty jealously.

Celebrating the the turning of mentally unstable people into non-persons by denying them any personal affects is really petty.

Re:

[waterford0069]

Too True... the US system is about punishment. Many other countries systems are about Corrections (both punishment an rehabilitation)

Re:Psychological Experiments

[DerekLyons]

It's looks like the US marshals office in all of it's jock strap douchiness is celebrating the failure of an ohh evil intellectual, "We will use the technology that Kaczynski railed against" speaks very much of petty jealously.

Nah, you're reading into it more than is there.
 

Celebrating the the turning of mentally unstable people into non-persons by denying them any personal affects is really petty.

Nah, it's standard practice to sell off items seized as part of law enforcement investigations/prosecutions. The only thing notable here is who the property once belonged to.

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[the_raptor]

Just because it is standard practice doesn't change the fucking point.

Seizing and auctioning of property by law enforcement ON THE MERE SUSPICION* of it being connected with crime is absolutely intended to render certain people as non-persons (aka people without fundamental rights).

Ted Kaczynski is fucking crazy but that doesn't mean his personal property should be allowed to be seized and sold. Seized for the purpose of investigation is entirely different.

* If the police in most of the English speaking wor

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[Anonymous Coward]

a link for the linkless: http://www.theatlantic.com/past/docs/issues/2000/06/chase.htm [theatlantic.com]

Re:

[Anonymous Coward]

Here's a link to what you referenced:

Harvard and the Making of the Unabomber
June 2000

http://www.theatlantic.com/past/docs/issues/2000/06/chase.htm

Re:Psychological Experiments

[Spy Handler]

Kaczynski was a guinea pig in the MK Ultra program... where people were subjected to "surreptitious administration of drugs and other chemicals, hypnosis, sensory deprivation, isolation, and verbal and sexual abuse. [wikipedia.org]"

Re:

[seven of five]

His father's suicide [jrank.org] didn't help much, either.

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[waterford0069]

Yes... that was in 1990 - 12 years after he started his attacks in 1978

Is this legal?

[Gr33nJ3ll0]

When did it become legal to auction of the property of convicted criminals? I understand we lost this right in drug cases, but terrorism now too?

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[mattack2]

What "right" are you talking about?

Isn't the auction to pay off a very very tiny fraction of the damage he has done to his victims? (e.g. medical bills for the survivors)

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[Gr33nJ3ll0]

I honestly don't know, hence the question. From what I can tell in the article, no rational for the auction of his personal property has been given. Was there also a civil trial that found him responsible for medical bills and such for the survivors?

Hoodie and glasses

[ukemike]

I want the hoodie and cop sunglasses from the famous police sketch.

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[blair1q]

don't recall seeing the hoodie (i browed the site a few weeks ago) but there were definitely several pairs of aviator sunglasses

It's a tarp!

[vawwyakr]

All buyers placed on theorist watch list.

Just buy this terrorist's effects...

[VortexCortex]

Just buy this terrorist's effects...

...We promise that we will not add you to a watch list, and that they contain no tracking devices.

most should have been donated

[rubycodez]

Most of these things should have been donated to psychology or criminology school, or similar scholastic endeavor.

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[smellsofbikes]

There's no shortage of psychos and crazies. What made Kaczinsky interesting was that he was a very smart psycho -- but even then, there are lots of those. All the interesting stuff he wrote is public record because it was used as evidence during the trial and published in the court proceedings. Ideally they'd sell all the stuff and use the proceeds to help repay medical costs/give disability benefits to the people he injured, but more likely they're going to use it to indirectly defray some of the cost o

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[rubycodez]

While the trial transcripts are freely available, the totality of the evidence would be hard to see without paying money. I have a solution for the ongoing cost of his incarceration, that costs less than 20 cents and makes a loud popping noise.

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[Darinbob]

A question was whether he really was crazy or not. Sure he's a criminal, but you don't have to be insane to kill people. Society doesn't like this though and is afraid of the idea of these awful acts like this being performed by rational people. Thus the quickly applied label of insanity, only a madman could act that way. So Oswald is insane, and McVeigh, and Kaczynski, and Osama.

The interesting thing about Kaczynski is that his writings are written very intelligently and rationally, no matter how much

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[rubycodez]

there is a shortage of the ability to quickly identify and arrest those with ASPD who are harming others

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[parlancex]

The proceeds from the auction are being donated to the families of the victims of the bombs to help pay the court ordered restitution that was initially handed down as part of Kaczynski's sentence. That's a pretty good cause I think, many of his victims had permanent damage that probably required a lot of time, pain, and money to undo, and even then only partially.

Time for the Moron Decree

[hackertourist]

Instead of giving such criminals a name (or worse, a nickname), it's time we start referring to them as "Moron # (sequential number)" and generally not giving them the attention they crave. No more notoriety!

Re:

[Anonymous Coward]

The thing is, Moron #2202674, someone already thought of that.

Creepy? What?

[EonsWrath]

To be honest, some of that stuff is creepy, but his written documents? That's cool, if i could get my hands on them that would be sweet. I love psychology of crazy humans. It's something very intriguing and interesting. Knowing how they function. I'm guessing people like me would buy such documents, and use it to identify other people who might try to do something similar. It is pretty freaky that they are selling his birth certificate

US Marshals?

[shentino]

Ok, quick question.

Why are the US Martials auctioning off his property? Doesn't it belong to his estate?

Re:

[devjoe]

His estate? He's not dead. He's still in prison. If you'd been watching the news recently you would have seen that they are now investigating him for the still unsolved 1982 Tylenol murders, and they asked him to submit a DNA sample for this investigation but he refused. (They may seek a court order to compel him to provide the DNA sample.) The auction is occurring because he's been ordered by the court to pay restitution to the families of the victims. The court judgement occurred in 2006. [sfgate.com] Ever since then

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[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

Kaczynski is a political prisoner

[br00tus]

Some people here are saying Kaczynski is not psychologically competent. At the trial he was found to be competent by the government psychiatrist, if he were not found so he would not be in jail but a mental institution. Not that psychology is a real study outside of the biological portion (and a very small subset of social scientific experiments) anyhow.

Everybody who doesn't agree with the dominant power structure in the US, imperialistic capitalism, and the culture around it, is ultimately "insane". Sa

I want the typewriter ...

[timothy]

Not so much for itself, as for a font I would like to offer to the world for filling in any IRS forms.

Hmm. Perhaps someone has already done this, based on published exemplars?

timothy

Many Good Actions

[b4upoo]

The violence can not be discounted or ignored but this man did have some very valid concerns and had a certain value to society. At the very least we can agree that he consumed very few resources in his personal life and we must admire that part of him.
This is another individual that may need confinement but should be given study tools and allowed to progress as best he can in his mental activities. He might be able to teach us