One of Disneyland's Longest-Running Attractions is Ditching Fossil Fuels (reviewjournal.com) 99
When Disneyland opened in 1955, its car-themed attraction Autopia "represented the future of what would become America's multilane limited-access highways," according to Wikipedia, " which were still being developed. President Eisenhower had yet to sign the Interstate Highway legislation..."
Wikipedia adds that the cars "generate a moderate level of exhaust from the Honda GX gasoline engines that propel the cars." But that may change, according to a climate-oriented newsletter from the Los Angeles Times: If anyone could get away with defending the toxic odor, it might be Bob Gurr. He designed the original Autopia cars in the mid-1950s, working closely with Walt himself. He's proud of what they built together. But today the 92-year-old Disney legend says the polluting motors need to go. "Get rid of those God-awful gasoline fumes," he told me.
Disney is finally preparing to do just that. In news shared exclusively with The Times ahead of this column's publication — after several weeks of my prodding the company for answers on the future of Autopia — Disney officials revealed that pure gasoline engines are on their way out... "As the industry moves toward alternative fuel sources, we have developed a roadmap to electrify this attraction and are evaluating technology that will enable us to convert from gas engines in the next few years," spokesperson Jessica Good said in an email. Good wouldn't confirm whether that means electric vehicles, or if hybrids are a possibility...
[Gurr] also expressed a grander vision for Tomorrowland as a hub for stories about renewable energy, public transit and other sustainable technologies that will help us create a better tomorrow... [H]ow about using the former Innoventions building, which once displayed futuristic technologies but is now closed to most guests, to showcase solar panels, lithium-ion batteries and other clean energy devices that guests might want in their homes...? Why not switch to electric cooking at the Alien Pizza Planet restaurant, and offer induction stove demos for diners? Maybe start screening some National Geographic films (Disney owns NatGeo) at the largely unused Magic Eye Theater...? Add some infotainment-style signs and voice-overs about the wonders of clean energy and public transit, and boom, you've got a Tomorrowland that should leave kids and their parents excited to help build a safer, happier, more sustainable world...
[Gurr] told me that if he could, he'd tear out everything in Tomorrowland except the Monorail and rebuild it as a version of the public transit-oriented futuristic city that Walt once planned for Florida — only with clean energy at the core of its storytelling... At the very least, he said it's time for an Autopia where guests "don't smell the fumes, don't hear that racket of the little motor going putt-putt-putt."
The newsletter agrees electric vehicles for Autopia are "the obvious starting point" for remodeling Tomorrowland with "a buzz of optimism and futuristic energy." ("Solar-panel shade structures over the line would be great too.") They even add that "it's not that it's my job to make money for Disney, but I'm sure the company could find sponsors for this vision of Tomorrowland. There are plenty of renewable energy companies, electric utilities and environmental groups eager to tout their causes and their credentials."
And it shares this observation from climate scientist and communicator Katharine Hayhoe (paraphrasing another scientist who studies climate communications): "Showing people what climate solutions look like is one of the most effective ways to get them to support action." The newsletter's conclusion? "This is where Tomorrowland could prove especially valuable in the fight to save the planet."
Some additional context... Disney's current CEO once said he was "particuarly proud" of the 270-acre, 50+-megawatt solar facility the company brought online in Orlando." And the Washington Post reports that Disney's plans to electrify Autopia "comes as the park is taking steps to decarbonize as part of an effort to reach a goal of net-zero emissions by 2030."
Wikipedia adds that the cars "generate a moderate level of exhaust from the Honda GX gasoline engines that propel the cars." But that may change, according to a climate-oriented newsletter from the Los Angeles Times: If anyone could get away with defending the toxic odor, it might be Bob Gurr. He designed the original Autopia cars in the mid-1950s, working closely with Walt himself. He's proud of what they built together. But today the 92-year-old Disney legend says the polluting motors need to go. "Get rid of those God-awful gasoline fumes," he told me.
Disney is finally preparing to do just that. In news shared exclusively with The Times ahead of this column's publication — after several weeks of my prodding the company for answers on the future of Autopia — Disney officials revealed that pure gasoline engines are on their way out... "As the industry moves toward alternative fuel sources, we have developed a roadmap to electrify this attraction and are evaluating technology that will enable us to convert from gas engines in the next few years," spokesperson Jessica Good said in an email. Good wouldn't confirm whether that means electric vehicles, or if hybrids are a possibility...
[Gurr] also expressed a grander vision for Tomorrowland as a hub for stories about renewable energy, public transit and other sustainable technologies that will help us create a better tomorrow... [H]ow about using the former Innoventions building, which once displayed futuristic technologies but is now closed to most guests, to showcase solar panels, lithium-ion batteries and other clean energy devices that guests might want in their homes...? Why not switch to electric cooking at the Alien Pizza Planet restaurant, and offer induction stove demos for diners? Maybe start screening some National Geographic films (Disney owns NatGeo) at the largely unused Magic Eye Theater...? Add some infotainment-style signs and voice-overs about the wonders of clean energy and public transit, and boom, you've got a Tomorrowland that should leave kids and their parents excited to help build a safer, happier, more sustainable world...
[Gurr] told me that if he could, he'd tear out everything in Tomorrowland except the Monorail and rebuild it as a version of the public transit-oriented futuristic city that Walt once planned for Florida — only with clean energy at the core of its storytelling... At the very least, he said it's time for an Autopia where guests "don't smell the fumes, don't hear that racket of the little motor going putt-putt-putt."
The newsletter agrees electric vehicles for Autopia are "the obvious starting point" for remodeling Tomorrowland with "a buzz of optimism and futuristic energy." ("Solar-panel shade structures over the line would be great too.") They even add that "it's not that it's my job to make money for Disney, but I'm sure the company could find sponsors for this vision of Tomorrowland. There are plenty of renewable energy companies, electric utilities and environmental groups eager to tout their causes and their credentials."
And it shares this observation from climate scientist and communicator Katharine Hayhoe (paraphrasing another scientist who studies climate communications): "Showing people what climate solutions look like is one of the most effective ways to get them to support action." The newsletter's conclusion? "This is where Tomorrowland could prove especially valuable in the fight to save the planet."
Some additional context... Disney's current CEO once said he was "particuarly proud" of the 270-acre, 50+-megawatt solar facility the company brought online in Orlando." And the Washington Post reports that Disney's plans to electrify Autopia "comes as the park is taking steps to decarbonize as part of an effort to reach a goal of net-zero emissions by 2030."
Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:5, Interesting)
This story reminds me of those stories of British councils doing lengthy evaluations of the suitability of EVs to replace their ICE vehicles for council staff. It just seems so pointless and over-complicated. Disney must have replaced its Autopia fleet dozens of times over the decades. How difficult can it be to include a requirement in the next procurement for electrification? The cars go at 7mph max! Back in 1955, they weighed less than 500lb. This is not a challenging engineering task, you could get like 10mpkWh for something that size and speed, and run it all day without needing to charge it with something like a 10kWh battery. If you really want to be fancy, build a battery bank, put a solar canopy over the parking area (or the line), charge the battery bank all day, discharge it all night. There's about 120 cars to charge -- maybe 1200kWh of power over say 10 hours, so 120kW an hour, ie about as much as a not particularly impressive fast charger delivers.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
I'm a little surprised that even back in the 1950s they didn't make the electric, given that they run on a track. Why bother with all the maintenance and fuelling overheads of an ICE when they could just make larger versions of slot cars?
Given it's supposed to be the future, even back in the 1950s, what amounts to a lawnmower engine isn't very futuristic.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
Probably because in the 1950s, internal combustion engines were the modern futuristic thing and electric was old technology. Electric cars peaked in the 1930s when they were mostly competing with steam and horse powered vehicles.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:5, Informative)
I don't think combustion engines were very new in the 1950s. That was well into the landspeed and stock car racing eras. I seem to recall manufacturers were experimenting with other forms of propulsion, including jet turbines. There was even talk of a nuclear powered car.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:4, Informative)
Well, actually... [wikipedia.org]
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
They didn't say "new" they said modern and futuristic. This is right around the time we here in the US start digging up all our railroad while going on a road building spree. The "bold future of the automobile" was just coming to full fruition at this time as we were in the midst of going all in on cars.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
Also the rumbling and vibrations were part of the ride. Push the pedal and you can hear it roar. For kids it's probably a closer feel for driving a car than being in the bumper cars would be. Never mind that they're breathing in really nasty fumes at the same time, something no one cared about in the 50s.
Sponsored by Chevron. (Score:3)
>> I'm a little surprised that even back in the 1950s they didn't make the electric
It was sponsored by Chevron.
Electric HAHAHA.
Re:Sponsored by Chevron. (Score:2)
Not a great ad for combustion engines. Little putt-putt lawnmower engines that exhaust the fumes right into your face.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
I'm a little surprised that even back in the 1950s they didn't make the electric, given that they run on a track.
Most of the track-powered rides are indoors, so the live rails don't get wet. They solved it on Test Track by mounting buss bars underneath the track surface. I'd imagine this is what they'll probably do with Autopia, so it's going to involve digging down and building a platform for the whole ride.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
That's a good point. Still, given the available motor technology in the 50s, i.e. decent enough performance at lower voltages where moisture isn't a problem, it still seems like less of an issue that having internal combustion fumes blown right into the faces of the riders.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
That's a good point. Still, given the available motor technology in the 50s, i.e. decent enough performance at lower voltages where moisture isn't a problem, it still seems like less of an issue that having internal combustion fumes blown right into the faces of the riders.
In the 1950s, that was the smell of the open road. The attraction was about getting kids hooked on American car culture when they're young. Judging by the fact I live in a neighborhood where most people take their cars just to pick up their mail, it obviously worked.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
>given that they run on a track.
but they're *not* on a track, the way some other rides are.
There is a road, and a limiter for how far the car can go. The car isn't usually in contact with the limiter.
To use it as an electric source would require some kind of flexible arm, which would make it a much more complicated system.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
Ah, I must have misunderstood how it works then. It looked like a track but I guess not.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:1)
This story reminds me of those stories of British councils doing lengthy evaluations of the suitability of EVs to replace their ICE vehicles for council staff. It just seems so pointless and over-complicated. Disney must have replaced its Autopia fleet dozens of times over the decades. How difficult can it be to include a requirement in the next procurement for electrification? The cars go at 7mph max! Back in 1955, they weighed less than 500lb. This is not a challenging engineering task, you could get like 10mpkWh for something that size and speed, and run it all day without needing to charge it with something like a 10kWh battery. If you really want to be fancy, build a battery bank, put a solar canopy over the parking area (or the line), charge the battery bank all day, discharge it all night. There's about 120 cars to charge -- maybe 1200kWh of power over say 10 hours, so 120kW an hour, ie about as much as a not particularly impressive fast charger delivers.
It's probably got far more to do with PR research, polling and psychoanalysis to ensure that they can do pull this off without been inundated with accusations of 'unpatriotic wokeness' and outright death threats from legions of angry MAGA drones than it has with any technological or engineering challenges related to transitioning to EVs.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
It's probably got far more to do with PR research, polling and psychoanalysis to ensure that they can do pull this off without been inundated with accusations of 'unpatriotic wokeness' and outright death threats from legions of angry MAGA drones than it has with any technological or engineering challenges related to transitioning to EVs.
Lately, Disney has been annoying those sorts of people as if it was it was part of their mission statement. The more likely reasons they're proceeding slowly are:
1. They're looking for a sponsor.
2. Disney always takes years to revamp an attraction. They just don't do anything quickly.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:0)
You don't have to try to annoy them, they get annoyed just at having non-MAGA people existing.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
Let's say they are switching to full electrics, which is probably the only sensible thing to do. And let's say they want to avoid down time, which makes the process more costly. Now suddenly there are actual considerations to the job. Who are the suppliers? Who is doing the conversion? What technologies are being used? Are the vehicles being replaced? They probably are. Will the new vehicles fit the old bodies or will they be completely replaced? Multiple years seems excessive but the idea that they can just snap their fingers and have a successful transition is misguided.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
I agree this is a project, I just don't think it needs a frigging roadmap. Yes, they have to consider most of the factors you mention, but not all of them. The tech is obvious -- BEVs. They don't need to get into chemistries. LFP or NMC ought to make no difference for them. Can't they just put out a tender?
Supply and maintenance of 200 small BEVs per site, plus associated charging infrastructure
Uptime requirements are X
Safety requirements are as before but with the following mods to take account of BEV instead of ICE (eg fire management)
Weight no more than Y
Use standard OTS components as far as possible
Etc
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
LFP or NMC ought to make no difference for them.
It should make no difference to them whether or not they use batteries which produce oxygen when heated, therefore one has a dramatically higher fire risk than the other, and is also drastically more difficult to extinguish if it does combust? What the fuck are you smoking and how do I make sure I never get any?
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
Oh c’mon. NMC chemistries are approved for use on the roads where vehicles travel at speeds where this an actually measurable risk of a battery pack being deformed by an accident, as opposed to 7mph. You wrote your post on a device with an NMC battery. It’s not plutonium! It’s a well-characterised tech whose safety record is more than good enough for this use. As we know, vehicle fire rates are dramatically lower for EVs on the roads, and would be even lower for Autopia, given the usage profile.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
Oh câ(TM)mon. NMC chemistries are approved for use on the roads where vehicles travel at speeds where this an actually measurable risk of a battery pack being deformed by an accident, as opposed to 7mph.
Collision is not the only possible reason for thermal runaway. I would prefer to continue this conversation, if at all, with someone who has an idea of what the issues are.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
Of course I know what thermal fucking runaway is. But the rate of EV fires from *all causes*, including but not limited to thermal runaway, collision and villains pouring petrol over them and setting them alight, is still between ten and one hundred times *lower* than for ICE vehicles*. So it's an absurd risk to worry about here, and the longer you bang on about it, the sillier you look.
* Swedish Civil Contingencies Agency reports 3.8 fires per 100k EVs vs 68 fires per 100k ICE vehicles; Tesla reports 11 times fewer fires per mile for its cars vs all cars; Australian DoD funded study found a 0.0012% chance of an EV catching fire vs 0.1% for an ICE vehicle.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
By spending 10% more for batteries with 5-10% less capacity they can virtually eliminate the threat, since it's really really hard to get a LFP to thermal runaway. Or they could just pretend it will never be a problem. If they're smart, they will take it seriously. Sometimes Disney employs smart people.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
Uh... NMC is not guaranteed.
The device I'm typing this on has a straight lithium non-rechargeable battery for the clock, as it's a desktop. Otherwise, the UPS it's hooked into is lead-acid. Zero NMC.
That said, you're right, properly protected batteries of whatever chemistry would work fine. Hell, given the limited use, lead-acid would work as well.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
Not only is that an excellent specific point, the more general point about this being a slow EV go-kart is really important. There are lots of EV go-kart manufacturers out there. It would be pretty straightforward for them to adapt one of their models to fit Autopia's needs / spec.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
Past experience indicates that they are not afraid of downtime. The Finding Nemo submarine thing in Disneyland was down for a couple of years for refurbing (not considering Star Wars because that was a new build)
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
Part of the challenge in going electric is that electric motors don't thump and growl, and the feel and noise of the vibrating engine is part of the fun of Autotopia.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:3)
Could be, although I’m pretty sure that Disney could use it as an opportunity to create new experiences, eg new sounds and even the opportunity to personalise (or at least choose from a selection)
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
Part of the challenge in going electric is that electric motors don't thump and growl, and the feel and noise of the vibrating engine is part of the fun of Autotopia.
Subwoofers and bass shakers are a thing. Though I'd imagine one of the goals of electrification specifically is to make the areas adjacent to the attraction more enjoyable without all the damn engine noise, so I doubt they'll be adding loud audio systems to the EVs.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
Never mind a roadmap, why do they need this attraction? I remember Autopia from when I was a little kid. The combo of the slow speed, fixed track, and no characters made it Boooooooring. Regular carnival bumper cars were more fun. Better to just scrap it and put in something more fun in general.
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
Build the entire track so that it only goes downhill. Make guests haul the cars up while they are waiting in line. Free energy!
Re:Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
That reminds me of this: the self-charging massive mining truck. The downhill fully loaded weight recharges the batteries for the uphill empty climb.
https://www.greencarreports.co... [greencarreports.com]
Re: Why on earth do they need a roadmap? (Score:2)
Everything old is new again. The couple-gear electric truck would do the same thing around a century ago. It was only a five ton truck, but it did have four wheel drive and four wheel steering...
You are what you are. (Score:1)
Disney officials revealed that pure gasoline engines are on their way out... "As the industry moves toward alternative fuel sources, we have developed a roadmap to electrify this attraction..
If Disney actually cared about the environment, they would shut themselves down and plant trees instead of excuses to continue to waste all manner of resources while creating literal tons of waste, for the purpose of entertainment.
Disney can’t change what it is. If a warmongering Army decided to start recycling all their bullet brass and dress their soldiers in organic hemp, it doesn’t change the fact they’re still a warmongering Army. At some point, we’ll stop pretending about justifying entertainment as a loophole.
Re:You are what you are. (Score:3)
Nobody cares about the environment. But Autopia is an anachronism and people hate breathing in noxious fumes from car exhausts. Back in the 50s, this was "progress". Like the smoking smokestacks were the signature items of the industrial revolution and back then something you put on posters when you wanted to appear progressive and modern, nobody would get excited about black soot from smokestacks these days.
Likewise, the "car smell" (read: exhaust) from the cars at Autopia that were "progress" back in the 50s are now "pollution". And it's kinda hard to sell a dream of perpetual motion and mobility on pollution.
So the cars must not stink anymore.
It's not about "going green", it's about protecting a brand. Autopia must not be seen as an anachronism, where individual traffic is associated with smog and breathing problems.
Re: You are what you are. (Score:2)
The number one âoenegativeâ comment from fans about this change appears to be that they will miss the sound and the smell. So, while most of your comment is on point, those two details donâ(TM)t go missed by leaders at TWDC who rely upon nostalgia to keep families coming backâ¦..
Re: You are what you are. (Score:2)
>> they will miss the sound and the smell
I don't think any of this will happen.
it's like in 1900 if you ask what people will be missing from their horses being replaced by cars.
Re: You are what you are. (Score:2)
They did and people still do. Hence all the dude ranch, and trail ride attractions.
The reality is people like small gasoline engines. They like the sound and the smell it is fun! Its not Disney but everyone I know loves the 'old-timey cars' at the local amusement park, they look like model Ts and run on a track different shell on something a lot like what is being discussed. All smiles, and always busy. The teenagers love the local go-kart establishment as well as ever as far as I can tell too.
(Yes I have done electric go-kart racing, fast, and fun but frankly slower with the pops and sputter of little gas motors is MORE fun even if you are going a lot slower).
The issue here really is that small gasoline engines are probably NOT the future of personal transportation so, they don't really 'fit' with the theme of the Disney park.
Now I know a bunch of people are going to reply - no I hate the noise of smell of little gas engines. Right when they are just outside your office window all day everyday, and you're stuck sitting on the lawn mower on Saturday, you do. Just like people probably got real tired of the smell of horse stalls too, however when it is something you don't experience except at your discretion; I suspect you'll feel differently.
Re: You are what you are. (Score:2)
This was opened in an era where LA was already clogged with traffic and smog was already a major concern (though many denied that auto emmisions were a cause then).
Re: You are what you are. (Score:2)
The reality is people like small gasoline engines. They like the sound and the smell it is fun!
Two-strokes are even better. Had some really fun dirt bikes and snowmobiles as a kid. Might be a good time to get another one before they are all gone.
Re: You are what you are. (Score:2)
They need to get with the times. Their new cars need to produce the hydrogen sulfide smell of catalytic converters.
Re:You are what you are. (Score:2)
But Autopia is an anachronism and people hate breathing in noxious fumes from car exhausts.
And because they're basically lawnmower engines, the fumes are actually significantly worse than car exhausts.
No Lawsuits? (Score:1)
Where are the boomers complaining about their drop in IQ from breathing in those leaded gasoline fumes those cars ran on for decades? You could smell those things stinking up the air outside of the ride.
Re:You are what you are. (Score:1)
And let's shut down every amusement park as well. And all video game companies have to go because of the amount of electricity wasted creating and using the games. And no concerts, either. All those people having to drive to one location, all the supplies and merch which have to be produced then shipped in, and the enormous amount of fossil fuels needed to transport the band from venue to venue and the electricity wasted to put on the show. The same for baseball, football (both kinds), hockey, rugby, etc. Forget beer making. Do you know how much fossil fuels are used to grow and cut the grains needed? Let's not get into the amount of electricity needed to produce it, bottle it, then transport it all over the country and continue to store it until purchase.
You know what, let's just get rid of any entertainment because all of it uses fossel fuels.
Hans Kristian Graebener = StoneToss
Re:You are what you are. (Score:2)
All amusement park rides have gone or are going electric. It's obvious why. You can run a bunch of them on one ultra-reliable honda generator instead of having a whole bunch of small engines to maintain (assuming you've got a mobile attraction like a traveling carnival) and they are much quieter so your amusement soundtrack/attract noises don't have to be as loud. You can centralize your fuel and noise and implement more safety features around it without having to do it multiple times. Controlling an electric motor is much more precise and reliable than screwing with clutches and throttles.
Re:You are what you are. (Score:2)
for the purpose of entertainment
Just so we're clear, are you the type of environmentalists who wants to eliminate all human life from earth or the type of environmentalist who merely wants to return us to an era when humans eked out a subsistence level existence and lived only to suffer and procreate?
Entertainment is a huge and important part of human life. Not specifically Disney, but all manner of non-life-sustaining activities that are done for enjoyment are what make living worthwhile. This is also not an exclusively human trait. Many species expend resources on entertainment.
It's certainly a good idea to maximize the ratio of entertainment value per unit of cost. Most people, and certainly Disney, do try to spend as little as possible to achieve a particular goal, but that doesn't mean spending nothing and failing to achieve any goals. Entertainment is a worthwhile goal to most humans and paying for it is a big part of the reason why people do the hard parts of earning money.
FYI the military does recycle (Score:2)
On the range, brass casing are picked up for 1) recycling and 2) more importantly to account for ammo to prevent theft.
Re:You are what you are. (Score:2)
There are more trees and non-grass plants per square unit (meter, feet, acre, olympic sized swimming pools) in Disneyland than in most neighboring suburbs that focus on lawns. Most theme parks are also parks - lots of plants because it's good shade for the visitors, good for just sitting down and relaxing while the kids go hyper, etc. Of course, they suck up a ton of water use in low-moisture Anaheim (as opposed to too-wet Orlando).
But are they gender neutral? (Score:0, Troll)
That is what Disney should ask itself.
Re:But are they gender neutral? (Score:0)
That is what Disney should ask itself.
Disneys electrician is quite positive that neutrals have a purpose, not a gender.
Re:But are they gender neutral? (Score:0)
Sweetie, we know you're gay for DeSantis but it's 2024 and no one cares.
Re:But are they gender neutral? (Score:2)
He's rocking some fabulous high heels though, you know he wants to be up there on the drag stage. Those who can, do. Those who can't, get mad and pass laws against it.
Re:But are they gender neutral? (Score:0)
Dragon deez balls across your face. Got 'em!!!
Re:Can you go a full day (Score:2)
Without thinking about who might have a penis? Do you get funny feelings when you see one?
Sponsors? (Score:3)
... but I'm sure the company could find sponsors for this vision of Tomorrowland.
I think a multi-billion dollar company should (be able to) pay for this themselves
Re:Sponsors? (Score:5, Insightful)
You don’t know a lot about being wealthy. The first rule is get someone else to spend their money.
Maybe (Score:2)
[H]ow about using the former Innoventions building, which once displayed futuristic technologies but is now closed to most guests, to showcase solar panels, lithium-ion batteries and other clean energy devices that guests might want in their homes...? Why not switch to electric cooking at the Alien Pizza Planet restaurant, and offer induction stove demos for diners? Maybe start screening some National Geographic films (Disney owns NatGeo) at the largely unused Magic Eye Theater...? Add some infotainment-style signs and voice-overs about the wonders of clean energy and public transit, and boom, you've got a Tomorrowland that should leave kids and their parents excited to help build a safer, happier, more sustainable world...
Maybe ... could be good, could be horrible.
I mean, it's not like we need more political propaganda in our world right now.
(Yes, yes, I know, your political propaganda isn't political propaganda; it's just good pure common sense ...)
Re:Maybe (Score:2)
They can call it "grand" but it sure doesn't sound fun. Isn't Disneyland supposed to be fun? You take a shuttle over to the ride and then find out that was the ride?
Re:Maybe (Score:2)
Remember, it was Disney who brought us the wonderful children's movie: Our Friend the Atom.
Funny (Score:3)
Maybe they can fix the big problem (Score:5, Funny)
The big problem with those old cars is that they aren't all the same speed. And it seems that the wife and daughter always get the faster car. And it seems that they are quite capable of resisting their need to taunt while they speed off at 6.5 mph ahead of your 6.3 mph car.
It's not fair. not fair.
Re:Maybe they can fix the big problem (Score:3)
That should be " incapable" of resisting their need to taunt, like I am incapable of typing on a phone.
Re:Maybe they can fix the big problem (Score:-1)
That's because you're fat. Harder to move a more massive object given the same energy.
Anyway, while you're still fat. You have no wife and daughter you loser. You're living in your moms basement and you know it.
Re:Maybe they can fix the big problem (Score:2)
yeah, it couldn't *possibly* be the weight difference . . . :)
In related news... (Score:1)
Re:In related news... (Score:0)
Utterly unrelated, and it sounds like you're bringing it up purely to be a misogynistic asshole.
So you should probably fuck right the fuck off now.
Autopia is Horrible (Score:3)
Autopia, sponsored by Honda, is so horrible that after we rode it, my pre-teen son said, I"m never buying a Honda. The smell is really disgusting, and the ride is outdated; it's too slow to be exciting for all but the youngest kids now, especially for something themed as being a racetrack.
Yes, Disney needs to do some planning for the technology to electrify the attraction, as they need to keep the cars moving most of the time. That likely means induction charging while they're driving.
This is also a good time for Disney to think about how they would design a driving ride today, It may be time to do far more than just replace the smelly cars with electric versions.
Re:Autopia is Horrible (Score:3)
It's the same with their Disney World counterpart, Tomorrowland Speedway, in Florida. My wife and I were there in Februrary and because I had never been to Magic Kingdom before (and was 30 years since being to Disney World at all), I wanted to ride absolutely everything. Speedway was one of the few attractions that I won't ride again when we return.
The big issue is that it feels extremely dated. Back in the 50s, when Disneyland was first built, the automotive industry was at its peak in the USA, and the attraction gave children the opportunity to do a "grown up" thing. Today it feels very out of place in "Tomorrowland." It's the type of mediocre "filler" attraction that feels like it exists more for little kids. Nothing super wrong with it when viewed in that light, but Disney is supposed to be great at theming and Tomrrowland as a concept is something that can find itself outdated very quickly and needs to be constantly renewed. Autopia / Speedway feels more like a blast from the past than something that is meant to showcase the future.
Electric cars make a lot of sense ... but even then, I'm not sure how to make that type of ride really fun. There's no bumping allowed, the speed is extremely slow, the handling is intentionally horrible (I think that's how they tried to make it fun, by making the steering an utter nightmare lol). They need to do something to make it either thrilling or challenging in a not-frustrating way.
So yeah. It was fine for a checklist item but I didn't really enjoy it and won't do it again as it currently exists.
Re:Autopia is Horrible (Score:2)
For a few decades, Disneyland had different types of tickets. The big rides that eveyrone loves and remembers were E tickets; Matterhorn, Haunted Mansion, etc. But there were A, B, C, D tickets also. You'd purchase a ticket book and it had a collection of each type, and the more E tickets it had the more expensive the ticket book. If everyone all went to Matterhorn at the same time it would be highly unpleasant to everyone, so spread it out so that the tourists go to a lot of different places. After doing all the fun rides you'd be left with a lot of lower value tickets, and so the lower value rides were there for that - Autopia, tea cups, etc, stuff that was definitely more in the style of a fairgrounds ride, but with Disney skins.
Though Mister Toad's Wild Ride has always held an ironic attraction to high schoolers for some reason...
We had a family friend who's son worked at Disney (as a sommalier!) so we'd get good bargains on tickets that she'd pull out of an shoe box. Later Disneyland changed to just have one entry fee that allowed you to go to any rides (noobs, Amazon knows you add a premium charge to any tv show worth watching).
I was also at Disneyland once with a high school club convention. After 7pm we had the entire park to ourselves, maybe a couple hundred students, max. Which meant that when we got of the Matterhorn we'd run around the entire circumference and get back to the line that had only half a dozen people. Until we got tired of that and tried a different ride.
Re:Autopia is Horrible (Score:3)
I'm guessing since they're using small engines that the cars don't have catalytic converters. I remember when lots of cars without them were still on the road, it smelled awful everywhere.
But something you probably don't realize most of the time because you're used to it: Cars stink.
They don't smell as bad as they used to, but they're still not pleasant to be around. And when you get behind some asshat redneck who removed the cat or somebody whose cat got stolen, it's truly awful. I'm looking forward to everything on the road being electric.
Re:Autopia is Horrible (Score:-1, Flamebait)
Re:Autopia is Horrible (Score:2)
The reason they sound bad when the catalytic converter is removed is because now the muffer is disconnected. Thieves don't have enough politeness to weld on replacement pipe.
Re:Autopia is Horrible (Score:2)
I'm not talking about the sound. I'm talking about the smell.
Re:Autopia is Horrible (Score:2)
As a bicyclist, I do notice cars being smelly. Some more so than others, but it's one of several strong incentives to find roads with few cars to bike on.
Re:Autopia is Horrible (Score:2)
I get it that car/engine exhaust can be a little annoying if you're just not in the mood for it, but a lot of people consider that part of the fun of enjoying things like racing/driving/autocross/rock-crawling, etc., etc. Also, you missed an opportunity to explain to your son that a 10-hp Honda engine is not the same as a 300 hp Honda engine in an actual car. Better start saving up for that $130k, low-emission Lexus for your kid.
Re:Autopia is Horrible (Score:2)
First, if you know anything about ICE's, Honda make some of the best in the world. Second, if you drive a ICE at 6-7 mph, in a line with others right in front of you, you might have some bad smells.
Try a real race track, or better yet, get on a trail/sand dune and see how horrible Honda ICEs are. Going 40mph... You won't smell a thing, except the warm liquid from you pants.
Re:Autopia is Horrible (Score:2)
This is also a good time for Disney to think about how they would design a driving ride today, It may be time to do far more than just replace the smelly cars with electric versions.
I know! They could make them self driving! You pay your money, sit down and and they move you around the track a couple of times while you play with your phone.
You could add some stop signs as well to show off how smart the cars are. It will be so much fun!
Re:Autopia is Horrible (Score:2)
I know! They could make them self driving! You pay your money, sit down and and they move you around the track a couple of times while you play with your phone.
You could add some stop signs as well to show off how smart the cars are. It will be so much fun!
Epcot already has this ride, it's called "Test Track".
Re:Autopia is Horrible (Score:2)
Autopia, sponsored by Honda, is so horrible that after we rode it, my pre-teen son said, I"m never buying a Honda. The smell is really disgusting, and the ride is outdated; it's too slow to be exciting for all but the youngest kids now, especially for something themed as being a racetrack.
Honda has powered Max Verstappen's Red Bull to three consecutive Formula One world championships and look set to dominate again this season. Clearly not Honda's fault Disney's racetrack is too slow.
Re:Autopia is Horrible (Score:0)
Meh. Formula E or don't bother. ICE is a dead technology.
Re:Autopia is Horrible (Score:2)
Why not decades sooner? (Score:2)
Re:Why not decades sooner? (Score:2)
I'm guessing because small children like to touch things, and don't know what high voltage is. And because big oil sponsored the thing for a long time.
It looks like the cars have some steerability from the pics, I've never seen it in person. That would add complexity to the pickups, particularly if they've got to be shielded from being able to be touched. Small gas engines are cheap, custom designed track riding electric pickups and track systems... aren't. And the rat loves to make money.
Since it doesn't run 24/7 (I'm assuming), batteries might make more sense.
Re: Why not decades sooner? (Score:2)
Re:Why not decades sooner? (Score:2)
>It looks like the cars have some steerability
some?
*full*
that's a restraining rail, not a track. It stops you from leading the road.
It does have the practical effect of forcing the car to go the right general direction if you *don't* steer, but in normal operation, you're not even touching it.
Re:Why not decades sooner? (Score:2)
Bad memories of Autopia (Score:1)
Next vision of the future (Score:2)
Next up, overloaded electrical grids and debates about building new power plants to meet the need.
Maybe they could cover Disneyworld in solar panels so it didn't feel like the surface of the sun in the summer.
Re:Next vision of the future (Score:3)
Maybe they could cover Disneyworld in solar panels so it didn't feel like the surface of the sun in the summer.
I'd be seriously considering it if I was Disney. I'd cover the parking lot right up in solar panels, and you could probably put panels up such that with other stuff there's always a spot to get out of the sun. That should provide enough power to cover most of the needs of the park.
Whoop- (Score:2)
-de-do.
Autopia is dated for Tomorrowland (Score:2)
It was created when the car culture was taking root in the US and we had visions of everyone driving on wide smooth highways.
I think it should be replaced with a a new ride with 2 seater flying cars or quad-copters. These could be mounted on carts that go around a hilly forested course with limited freedom of movement of altitude, pitch, and yaw like a rail shooter. They could even stick with their Star Wars property and make it like chasing speeder bikes in an Endor forest.
Re:Autopia is dated for Tomorrowland (Score:0)
Nah, if they're going for the future, replace it with a high speed train simulator.
Surprise surprise (Score:2)
So we were at World for March Break. I remember thinking "how is this still a thing?" as we walked by Tea Party next to Autopia. It stank. Like, *ugh*. It was like being in the 1970s again.
I'm all for history, but surely the world's most boring ride devoted to slowly moving along a simulation of being stuck in traffic could be better utilized. It takes up as much room as Tron.